Official Discussion: Logan Lucky [SPOILERS]

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:19:51+00:00

Whole thing reminds me of Jon Hamm. After Jon Hamm absolutely killed the role of Don Draper, one of the most unhappy characters in television, he went on to do some amazing comedy stuff like his appearances on 30 Rock and his SNL episodes. Showed me a whole new side of him. I wish he did more.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:18:22+00:00

Obviously Logan gets the award for most emotional climax but I gotta say, I got really emotional when Tatum's daughter sang the John Denver song instead of Umbrella and the crowd joined in. What a cute moment.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:17:18+00:00

"Are you calling from a landline or a cell phone?"

"It's... a phone... like a real phone."

My main complaint was that for a minute after the heist it seemed to start dragging because it was just still going. But when the twist came that he paid off everyone involved, even involuntarily, I really appreciated the third act. The entire cast was great.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:16:00+00:00

The real long con is that half the people who got their own title cards in the trailer are in the movie for about two scenes. Not a complaint, although I do think some of the characters were rushed. Could have introduced the race car driver much earlier and Swank just kind of shows up and takes over the movie. I still loved it although I was a little confused about the very end. Was Swank going rogue undercover to solve the mystery? I presume that's it but it was played a little ambiguously.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:15:16+00:00

I think there was a little nod to Cool Hand Luke as well.

When the Warden was walking through the cafeteria checking in on the prisoners he asked one prisoner how he was doing. The prisoner replied something like, "Gettin' by, Warden." Warden replied, "Get on by then, [inmate's name]"

That's how the guards and prisoners spoke to each other in Cool Hand Luke. There's a whole scene where the dialogue is all, "Gonna take my shirt off, boss." "Go on take ya shirt off, Luke." "Drinkin' some water now, boss." "Go on drink some water, Luke."

Idk, it's a very specific rhetoric I thought it was neat to see it pop up again.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:11:56+00:00

"Or as I like to call it... A Joe Bang."

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:11:11+00:00

I wish this movie had more of that whimsical magic but even for a quick joke that bear was gold. This movie wasn't a laugh a minute but when it was funny it was really funny. Some lines were just hilarious because of the great accents and annunciation.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T09:08:58+00:00

On the front page of the site there's a button that says "What is the tomatometer?" that brings up a window saying how the number is derived and what the different symbols mean. If you click on a specific movie it shows percentage of critics that liked it, percentage of regular viewers, reviews counted, how many were positive, how many were negative, and a quick consensus.

Like, I get that if you google "The Matrix Rotten Tomatoes Score" a little paperclip doesn't pop up to teach you how to read it, but it's not like they're hiding it. Anyone who uses RT regularly should know and if people are judging a movie based off a number they don't understand that's nobody's fault but their own.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-18T08:35:39+00:00

I don't think it rewards mediocrity. Rotten Tomatoes is a source that tells you what percentage chance there is you will enjoy a movie. It's not Rotten Tomatoes fault that people misinterpret that to equal quality. If a movie has a 90% on RT there is still a chance you won't like it, but the odds say you will probably feel you got your money's worth.

As for the difference between safe movies like Wonder Woman and Spider-Man, I really don't see the difference. Most awards season movies and other kinds of high art movies tend to do pretty well on Rotten Tomatoes. Moonlight is sitting at a 98%, Spotlight is at 96%, Jackie 89%, Dunkirk 93%, A Ghost Story 91%, Her is at 94%. I'm just spitballing some recent titles off the top of my head but I would say those movies didn't exactly play it safe but still scored as high as you could ask for.

A Rotten Tomatoes score isn't about quality, but I don't think it's fair to say it dips in favor of one type of movie over another. I'm sure you could find examples to show it does but at the end of the day it's all about knowing where the numbers come from and how to interpret them.

Besides, the only system RT is actually affecting right now is high stakes box office. I don't think quality indie filmmakers are worried that Rotten Tomatoes is affecting their audiences. The only people making noise about it are the people putting 150 mil into shit scripts and wondering why their money isn't multiplying. Gotta blame it on someone when the boss comes calling.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-16T21:38:06+00:00

It's pretty rare that people we argue with in meta threads actually pay attention or accept any of our reasoning so you can see why sometimes we get defensive. Thanks for being reasonable.

The problem with moderating is you have to be pretty black and white about it. The second you break your own rules you have someone in modmail calling you out on it. That or a month later someone will break the same rule then call you out and link the the old post when you remove theirs. Rules are rules and here the rule is that news is confirmed news. We do this so that our sub can be a generally trusted source of news. We like to think of you read it here it's actually happening. That's why we will never allow a post along the lines of "Actor at center of major franchise may or may not want to return as major character." While comic and movie fans will find something to discuss and speculate there there isn't actually any news. News by our definition would be, "Ben Affleck has said he will not be returning to play Batman" or "Studio announces Ben Affleck will not be in any further DC films as Batman." The difference is those things would be developing news. Digging into what Ben's comments mean or speculating that he's not happy playing Batman is our definition of rumor and the second we allow it is the second we give ammunition to someone who wants to post a story about how Vin Diesel dropped a hint in an interview that he's replacing RDJ as Iron Man.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-16T21:10:01+00:00

We've responded to what happened with the JL trailer versus the Thor trailer many times. It's not our fault DC fans don't believe us. We are very transparent but we can't make people believe they're franchises aren't being oppressed. The JL trailer was an Automod mistake, we fixed it within 15 minutes. If you choose not to believe that then I have nothing else for you.

As for our franchise rules, they really aren't that extreme. We actually use them on a lot more movies than just comic book movies. It's a pretty simple concept. Hardline news only. Confirmed news is always new content and will always be allowed. As mentioned we don't allow rumors for any movie. Discussion on these movies that everyone has seen like Star Wars and Marvel etc has happened hundreds of times in this sub. We aren't saying no to those discussions, we are acknowledging they have happened in spades and encouraging more varied posting.

And yes, if we made a sticky post today asking if these rules should still be enforced we would get positive feedback from the community. Our daily users are more than just people who want to speculate on comic book movies, and there are huge subreddits with lots of users for people who want that. We come up with new rules we think are necessary every few months or so. We always make a sticky asking the sub how they feel and we always give them a 30 day test run. Every single time the feedback is the same. Police the sub and keep content varied. Those are our daily users talking and we listen.

The arguments you're making have been made to us many times before. Just like if the rules swung your way we'd hear the opposite argument hundreds of times. What you have to ask yourself is whether or not you think you know this sub and its wants better than us knowing that our mod team has always been picked from long time users. Even I was a regular poster here for years before becoming a mod. All we want is a better place for varied movie discussion and if you don't believe that then we might as well just agree to disagree.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-16T18:38:49+00:00

First off, these kinds of meta complaint posts mean almost nothing to anyone without links. It's really easy to say quality has gone down or your favorite posts are being censored by paid shills but it really doesn't help us figure out what you think the problem is with absolutely zero links or proof of what you're talking about. But I'll try to respond to this anyways.

When I first joined this sub about a year ago, I was excited to discuss film with film lovers like myself. Although there are very rare times, where movies can be discussed openly and subjectively, they're met with harsh criticism and ignorance at times depending on what's currently popular, what the hive mind "fanboy" mentality is or what will net the most upvotes, which unfortunately sways the public opinion of bandwagoners, people that want to fit in and the sub becomes a vacuumed echo chamber or sorts.

This is how all of reddit works. Things that are popular to the reddit demographic are popular on reddit. When I first joined this sub about six years ago it was hard to find discussion until I realized that as long as I didn't concern myself with upvotes there was plenty of ranged discussion to be had in the new queue. Maybe not the most popular posts, but the discussion was there.

To add on to that, specific posts are removed and censored so they don't show up on the feed, preventing them from gaining notoriety and making the front page. Only certain posts gain popularity because they're set up to be that way from seemingly paid upvotes, paid-for comments and apparent shills. It honestly feels like the sub is bought and paid for by Disney/Netflix at times. Before joining this sub, I had a vague idea about what a shill was. I learned.

Netflix and Disney don't have to pay us for upvotes. The users are the ones who love them and upvote them. Posts that get removed get removed because they break our rules. We have lots of them. If you're ever curious about why a post was removed you can message us and ask. You may not agree with our reasoning but our reasoning is there and our rules are there to make this a good source of movie news and discussion.

The sub has gone from being somewhat open and discussion worthy to being a dump site for movie site "news", made up controversial rumored articles with smear campaigns and buzz words, and the most recent Netflix or Disney trailer, which is every other odd post (take a look for yourself by scrolling down the feed).

First off, I went through our front page and there are currently zero trailers for Netflix or Disney films. Not really sure why you'd challenge us to do that when it doesn't back up your point. Second, we absolutely do not allow rumor or click bait or buzzwords. It's like the foundation of our movie news rules. We are waaaaaayyyy more harsh on articles here than say /r/television. I would bet the articles you are complaining that are getting censored are probably being ruled rumor due to bad sources but again, hard to say because you're not providing any links or proof. When it comes to movie news we only allow verified studio news, we don't allow "sources say" or "x actor wants to play y popular character" or anything like that. We try and make this sub a good source for movie news, not a forum for speculation and rumor.

I used to enjoy coming to this site for my "'movie fix" but now it's more of a glance, here and there. I used to submit passionate, thought provoking posts here but realize it may not be the place anymore for open minded, thoughtful discussion and analyzation regarding one of my favorite mediums, instead it's become much more about promoting the newest film so people can go see it, shitting on the same particular movies because of their Rotten Tomatoes score or praising the same couple films/studios/directors over and over and over for the same reason.

You sound like you're submitting essays that belong in /r/truefilm. I looked through your submissions. No offense but they seem pretty low effort by our standards. In the last several months you submitted the Rocky IV training montage with the title "The montage to end all montage", the "Doug" song from the Hangover, and the trailers from Tropic Thunder. These kinds of posts are now not allowed because too many users were taking over our front page by submitting a single scene from a movie that reddit loves. We were seriously getting like 15 a day on our front page. Maybe that's what's changed? Are those the kinds of quality posts you are looking for?

Seriously though, if you have any questions about removals or rules feel free to message us in modmail. I don't know how I can prove to you that we aren't paid shills but literally no one has ever offered us money for moderating a movie forum. Seriously, it's not worth their time. The numbers don't add up. The reddit filmgoing demographic is so small compared to general movie going audiences. If anything studios continue to do things that piss off our users that general audiences don't care about like revealing trailers and bad marketing. I can't stress enough just how little giant corporations care about what goes on on /r/movies.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-10T19:48:56+00:00

Wait for what? It's out. Anyone who really needed to know has seen it by now and those who don't can take the overwhelmingly negative critical reception as a hint.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-10T00:57:44+00:00

ESPN didn't actually have an option to let low scores win so I just inverted all the point totals. Maybe I can mess with it a little more than that and see what I come up with.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-06T22:44:07+00:00

He asks if we really want to see it.

Well, we upvoted it didn't we? What more proof does he need!

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-04T03:05:46+00:00

When they got to the village where they took refuge for a while I was like, okay I will put this in my top ten movies of the year if we get a solid Tull massacre adaptation. Silly me to think this movie might have a cool scene.

I like how there's the scene where he knifes the dude in the back and the camera pans backwards to show like eight more bodies. I was like hey maybe that would have been a cool scene to see him stealthily get through those guys but I guess that too would have been dangerously close to having a good scene.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-04T02:34:10+00:00

I wanna say Gunslinger opened up on a wild west Saloon piano playing Hey Jude but it's been a while I could be mistaken.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-04T02:13:03+00:00

Sadly there were like zero memorable monster designs. So much opportunity too but nothing stood out.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-04T02:11:45+00:00

Haha I had the same thought. There's a scene where they literally watch the beam of light go towards the tower during an attack. Then they're like okay now we have to figure out where the man in black's base is. Crazy idea: walk towards that giant beam of light that's attacking the tower.

Also the part that was frustrating about that final fight is they move so much away from where they started. Like they get on a moving bus and fight on it for a bit. So when he dies I'm like great Roland has like half a mile to cover before he can get back to the portal. Nope, just shows up to it in the next scene. Do time and distance even matter in this movie?

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-04T02:10:31+00:00

The hospital scene garnered laughter from my theater, but I believe that was the only time I heard them react to anything at all on screen. The rest was like we were waiting for a Dr. appointment.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-08-04T02:03:27+00:00

This movie is really boring and when it's not boring it's frustrating. I guess I'll start with my familiarity with the series. I've read Gunslinger and loved it. I think I read the second and half the third books as well but eventually fell off because I suck at long commitment reading. But I'm familiar with the franchise.

That said, this wasn't even worth calling a disappointment. I knew it'd be bad, all the signs pointed to it. You can't go off cast alone with these big movies. But that doesn't excuse it for simply being boring. I never felt any emotional impact, connection with the characters, fear that there was a time limit, or any high stakes whatsoever. It was just things happening the movie.

The thing fans will prolly hate most is the lack of what makes the Dark Tower series unique. Seems like they worried about alienating newcomers so instead of having an interesting mid world where The Beatles is being played in an old West type saloon, it's just completely generic. I think I heard exactly one "Thankee, Sai"

There's also bad logic in it. There's a scene where they are trying to track the kid by tracking the use of his powers and the man in black goes "Don't worry I left a surprise for him at home." Maybe I misunderstood their goal but if you know he's going there why not just beat him there. And wait for him. I dunno just spit balling here.

Positives were performances but even those were watered down by bad dialogue. The CGI wasn't even very good. Idk about worst movie of the year but it's definitely not good.

Edit: Also is this really the only movie they have planned? Eight books with intense buildups and world building condensed into 90 minutes of YA thriller? It's like they made Lord of the Rings into Percy Jackson. When they killed the Man in Black I was like really? It's over now?

LiteraryBoner · 2017-07-31T00:09:35+00:00

I gave it a listen when I bought tickets to a fest he's gonna be at this year and now it's one of my most rotated albums. So dense, so funky, so groovy.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-07-30T21:34:17+00:00

Could be translated to, "I've glanced at every post that gets to the front page of /r/all from movies for literally days and no one has mentioned Willem Dafoe so allow me."

The problem with clickbait is that half the people who employ it don't even know it. They just think that's how things are titled now.

LiteraryBoner · 2017-07-30T04:48:54+00:00

I was gonna remove this but my finger slipped and stickied it instead. So I was gonna rectify that when I noticed it took the place of the emoji movie discussion so I figured no harm really done.

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